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Redhead Ember

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Wed Nov 25, 2015 8:42 am

@Shadowpath wrote:
...Danish News are you insinuating he got hit by the same bullet 16 times. Are you fucking kidding me.
Also tuMBLR STOP BEING DOWN ALL THE DAMN TIME ARGFH

Wait... what?

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Trollbabe

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:31 pm

To everybody who tells me the Muslims are going to take over America and impose Sharia law:

I grew up under Sharia law. It would never fly here. The oil company that employed my father had to bail expat employees out, and send them home, for all kinds of infractions.

Americans can't even obey American laws.

I agree, we should do something about women's rights in other countries, but may be we should clean up our own house first?

End of rant, back to Thanksgiving.


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KR Wordgazer

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:02 pm

Not ranting so much as kind of bothered.  A few months back I was the object of an Internet shark feeding frenzy on a certain religious blog.  It happened because I didn't know there was such a thing as Hellenic Paganism (modern belief in Zeus, Hera, Appollo, etc) and I said something not very nice about Zeus and the ancient worship of the Greek gods.  Someone fired back at me saying he was Hellenic and didn't appreciate my words. Still not understanding that this was a real thing in the modern world, I said something else that got me in even hotter water.  After that, I understood I had actually offended some actual people and apologized.  And apologized again. And again.  And again.  And each time I did they rubbed my face in it a little harder and started accusing me of the equivalent of "white tears" (which is a term for a white person who cries when confronted with something racist they said, thus making it about their feelings instead of what they said).  Never mind that "white tears" usually means the person cries INSTEAD of apologizing and saying they won't do it again.

Anyway, I decided it was an unsafe place to post and stopped posting there (I also hated the way I'd been humiliated and made a new rule for myself that if an apology is not accepted, I will no longer offer a second or third one but will just walk away).  

All that is water under the bridge now.  I still read the blog, because I like what the writer has to say, but I no longer read any of the comments or attempt to comment myself.  And that was fine.

Until yesterday when the blog owner issued a "thank you" to all the people who post on his blog.

Here's what he said:

I’m writing here for the people who read this, so instead of just listing broad, general reasons for gratitude, let me take this chance to say thank you to you — to give thanks for you. Thank you for reading this. Thank you for commenting here — for sharing jokes and encouragement, kitten pics, and the insights and criticisms that help me learn and keep me honest. Thank you for sharing, liking, retweeting and linking. Thank you for reading ebooks and posting reviews. Thank you for donating to the tip jar. Thank you for sticking up for one another, for bearing one another’s burdens, rejoicing with those who rejoice and mourning with those who mourn.

So, this is what kind of burns me.  Not once during that whole feeding frenzy did the blog owner attempt to tone any of his regulars down or ask them to be a little kinder.  No one stuck up for me (one person did finally come on and say something after it was all over about how it had been taken too far, but by that time there was not much point).  No one thought I was anything but a voice that needed to brutally silenced.  They were "us" and I was "them." His regular commenters are not the lovely people he thinks they are, and he knows it.

There's not a lot else to say except that I needed a safe place to vent about it, and this is that place. Thank you.

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:08 pm

It really sucks that you were treated like that, Wordgazer. That's just not right, no matter the blog or topic.
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Davrille

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:17 pm

Wordgazer, any Hellenic Pagan who can't admit the Greek gods were considered unpleasant at best and downright dangerous at worst by the ancient Greeks is a fool. They were wrong to treat you that way, and they know it.

<- Norse Reconstructionist who hung out with a couple Hellenics some years ago.
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KR Wordgazer

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sat Nov 28, 2015 4:02 am

Thank you, both of you. That's very comforting.

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sat Nov 28, 2015 4:53 am

Gosh, those Greek gods were bizarre. And nasty! This sounds more like Greek nationalism at work...I guess that when you meet crazy like that it's best to disappear and not give them the satisfaction of a reply. And since when were the ancient Greeks and their gods not white?
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KR Wordgazer

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sat Nov 28, 2015 2:20 pm

Elwing, I don't know if any of the commenters were Greek nationals. This wasn't about race, actually-- they didn't accuse me of "white tears" per se, but of the equivalent-- that is, that as a member of a majority religion I was upset, not that I offended them, but that my own religious biases were being exposed.  And yes, my religious biases were exposed in that I had never heard of this minority religion-- but to judge my motives as they did was not only mistaken, but arrogant.  They didn't know me-- how could they tell my apologies were insincere?

I think the people who follow this religion are mostly white Europeans; maybe some Canadians or US citizens.  And the issue (if I remember it correctly) was that I said I considered early Christianity to be a better option than the worship of ancient Zeus, because of the character of Christ compared to the character of Zeus.  I understood quickly how that was offensive-- the problem was that they had decided I was the enemy and wouldn't accept my apologies or stop raking me over the coals (and then blaming me for being upset over being raked over the coals).

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Embala

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sat Nov 28, 2015 3:10 pm

I'd say those people had a much bigger problem with "being biased" than you, Wordgazer. *hugs*
Sounds strangely familiar to me ... a case of "you HAVE TO tolerate how we are - but there's no need at all for us accept anything beyond our own believes".

No chance to apologize or explain anything to people with THIS "strong opinions", no use to discuss. You did right to leave. I'm sorry you had to go through this. Hug

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sat Nov 28, 2015 3:33 pm

Well, as I consider all religions imaginary, I can't help you there. But any modern humans worshiping ancient Greek gods, I'm sure it exists, but I have never encountered it. I reckon it's something like British druidism, but that at least has some kind of historic foothold. I learn something new every day.
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KR Wordgazer

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 4:00 am

Thanks, Embala and Elwing.  Really, as I said before, my real issue is with the blog owner who praised and thanked his commenters for their character and kindness, when his commenters at least once ganged up against another commenter-- namely, me-- and drove her away.  And he did nothing and said nothing to stop them.  It makes me wonder how many other times this has happened on that blog.  This blogger spends a lot of time writing against tribalism and us-vs.them thinking, but he didn't do anything practical when it was actually happening on his own blog.

Or maybe he was on their side all along.  Maybe he just assumed with the rest of them that I was the horrible person they were making me out to be; that I deserved to be driven out.  In which case he was being tribalistic himself-- which is plain hypocritical.

I don't know. It just bothers me.

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 5:35 am

Im sorry, but "Hellenic paganism" is bullshit. Just sayin.

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 5:35 am

I wouldn't think twice about that guy. My take is that he's a moron who lives in lala land.

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 6:19 am

@Lunakat wrote:
Im sorry, but "Hellenic paganism" is bullshit. Just sayin.

Well that's a bit blunter than I wanted to put it, but basically, agreed.
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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 1:50 pm

Back from a small march about climat change. Interesting how that kind of meeting is being forbidden at the moment here (France), especially those about climat (with the COP21 coming), while meetings to buy things and have fun are still allowed. Not that I am against those but it tells a lot Evil or Very Mad
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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 2:58 pm

@Lunakat wrote:
I wouldn't think twice about that guy. My take is that he's a moron who lives in lala land.

Well, that's just it.  He isn't.  He's smart, wise and realistic.  He cuts to the heart of things the way few bloggers do.  That's why I like reading his blog so much.

He himself isn't a Hellenic pagan, BTW. But apparently a group of them follows his blog.

I think I'm going to chalk it down to an area of personal blindness such as we all have, and let it go.  It helped to talk about it here. Thanks, everyone.

Miscellaneous, is France forbidding meetings because of the recent terrorism? I'd like to express my sympathy and solidarity with you and all the people of France.

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 3:11 pm

KR Wordgrazer, I am sorry you had to deal with that. The guy sounds incredibly pretentious to me. The persona this guy put out online (intelligent, wise, realistic, etc) seems very at odds with how he's handling anything (immature, hypocritical, full of himself). Sounds like a total mob mentality to me over there. Feeding frenzy. Impossible to feel safe in a place like that.

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 3:24 pm

Thank you KR Wordgazer Smile
Yes, it's bad luck those attacks happened just before those big climate change gathering. But people in Paris seems to have find a way: their shoes are doing the march for them: http://www.theguardian.com/environment/commentisfree/2015/nov/29/the-paris-climate-summit-a-real-test-of-humanity
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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 4:06 pm

@Miscellaneous wrote:
Back from a small march about climat change. Interesting how that kind of meeting is being forbidden at the moment here (France), especially those about climat (with the COP21 coming), while meetings to buy things and have fun are still allowed. Not that I am against those but it tells a lot Evil or Very Mad

Things got out of hand in Paris. Seems the French police are acting very repressively, and some protesters give them plenty of reason for that. I guess we can't have nice things.
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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 8:18 pm

@Zadzi wrote:
KR Wordgrazer, I am sorry you had to deal with that. The guy sounds incredibly pretentious to me. The persona this guy put out online (intelligent, wise, realistic, etc) seems very at odds with how he's handling anything (immature, hypocritical, full of himself). Sounds like a total mob mentality to me over there.  Feeding frenzy. Impossible to feel safe in a place like that.

This is interesting because I think it's an example of the same kind of dynamic I experienced on that guy's forum.  Because all of you are predisposed to take my side (thank you!), you're also predisposed to see this blogger in the worst light. Even when I say something positive about him, you see him as insincere, as pretentious or manipulating.  But I think what I said about him is really true.  He's not coming across that way to blow his own horn; he really IS one of the smartest, wisest bloggers I've seen on the Internet.

It's just that when the same thing was happening to me on his blog-- his regulars choosing to see everything I said in the most negative light, so that even my apologies were interpreted as insincere and manipulative-- he did nothing.  I see it as his responsibility as the blog owner, to step in when his commenters get out of hand.  Maybe he doesn't see it that way.  Maybe he had a good reason for not stepping in.  Maybe, just maybe, he was gone that day and didn't check back, and missed the whole exchange.  

I think this is a common dynamic in social interactions: a tendency to view our own side with leniency and the other with condemnation.  I don't want to fall into the same error again (because I have done this before myself).  What happened was hurtful to me, and I deeply appreciate the affirmation and support from all of you. But I'm going to try to give the blog owner the benefit of the doubt, and even acknowledge that many of the commenters themselves are probably not so bad when offline.

At least, once I stop feeling mad about it.  Twisted Evil

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 11:51 pm

Well, except the person you are talking about is not here and we are not bashing him while you sit on the sidelines watching , right? Of course I'm taking your side because you're hurt and that's a natural empathy. I don't feel having an empathy for one side needs to be to the exclusion of another perspective, unless the other person chooses to be silent. At any rate, I'm sorry you're feeling the way you do! And I hope you feel better Hug



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Zadzi

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Sun Nov 29, 2015 11:52 pm

Heres my rant:
I DON'T WANNA PACK ! We're moving and have 3 days to do it and the weather sucks and it's raining and my back hurts and waaahhhhh! I need an epsom salt bath and I haven't even moved yet !

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Mon Nov 30, 2015 12:40 am

You're sweet, Zadzi. And I'm sorry you have to move when the weather and your back aren't cooperating. Hug

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:37 pm

*Yells at character*
HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO MAKE YOUR CLOTHES LOOK 'JUST ARRIVED'-HIGH ONE-ISH WHEN YOU JUST GO 'I just want a poncho.Ponchos are nice!'

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PostSubject: Re: Rant Away Please   Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:42 pm

@ KR Wordgazer, thank you! I hope you're feeling better.

@ Shadowpath ...you crack me up.



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