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Elwing

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 6:37 am

Nothing positive about #12? I'll kick this off,- I actually quite liked what happened to Reef. It made sense and gave his character a new dimension.
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 7:37 am

I loved Dart and Menders cuddle.
And I like Rayeks storyline.

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Miscellaneous

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 2:00 pm

Me too! Especially:
Spoiler:
 

I spent far too much time staring at that cuddle... The Dart and Mender parts in FQ are very well drawn! Which remind me: the p 8 of FQ 11, where Dart and Mender are talking, is a exemple of good use of copy/paste. Because it's a close up, and because there is little time between 2 pictures, it works (in my opinion. Unlike the rest of the reuses).
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Sifra

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 2:24 pm

@Miscellaneous wrote:
Me too! Especially:
Spoiler:
 
I spent far too much time staring at that cuddle... The Dart and Mender parts in FQ are very well drawn!

That was very cute!


@Miscellaneous wrote:
Which remind me: the p 8 of FQ 11, where Dart and Mender are talking, is a exemple of good use of copy/paste. Because it's a close up, and because there is little time between 2 pictures, it works (in my opinion. Unlike the rest of the reuses).

I'm glad you liked that part. I hate it. Wendy used to draw such beautiful dialogues, making every conversation dynamic and interesting, using every possibility a comic has to offer. This just looks cheap and rushed to me.

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 2:38 pm

Ah! To bad you didn't like! I see what you mean, it's not "using every possibility a comic has to offer". I guess it is cheap in some way, but I see it as "professional" cheap, unlike some pages  with proportion mistakes, characters not blending in the background... That page didn't... agressed my sense of aesthetic same as others do tongue

and I love those Dart close up
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Sifra

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 2:43 pm

Maybe I need to focus more on the close-up, too, and less on the fact that it is recycled. Smile

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ErinC1978

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 4:28 pm

@Miscellaneous wrote:
Me too! Especially:
Spoiler:
 

I spent far too much time staring at that cuddle... The Dart and Mender parts in FQ are very well drawn! Which remind me: the p 8 of FQ 11, where Dart and Mender are talking, is a exemple of good use of copy/paste. Because it's a close up, and because there is little time between 2 pictures, it works (in my opinion. Unlike the rest of the reuses).

Yes, as hard as I am on the copy/paste, I agree -- for me that page works really well because it's 1) part of the same very close sequence, and 2) I think it actually increases the feeling of intimacy, because they're so close together physically and emotionally at this moment and they're not moving out of that moment even to shift their bodies.
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wingthing

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 5:00 pm

You know what I kinda wish Wendy had done? Released the FQ in "storybook" form the way Shards #16 was done, and that one ish of Wild Hunt when Ember was exiled. That way she could have really concentrated on a few good art pieces rather than recycling all the time and outsourcing the coloring to Sonny.
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Stargazer

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Sun Nov 29, 2015 7:12 pm

I've had the same thought Wingthing.
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Redhead Ember

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Mon Nov 30, 2015 9:58 am

I love the same about issue 12 that I love about all the other issues; the story and exitement. It's weird, and strange, and confusing, and it turns everything I thought I knew up-side-down. But... is that a bad thing?
Probably because I love the story I don't care if there might be some re-uses every now and then, or if Wendy has pre-saved 'bases' for each character; if it helps give her time to concentrate on coming up with the awesome story, then cool with me. Cutter Cool Oh, and I love Sonny's colouring; still partly convinced that if I turned off the light while reading that panel with Mender in issue 2 (right before he kills Lodok) then his eyes will actually glow.

A more specific issue 12 thing is this:
When Cutter-Timmain explains what's going on to Cutter she describes Timmain's spirit as having split into twin flames. Now, remember what Teir's and Ember's new swords are called? Treestump

Also this - from the short-text-describtion-thingy:

Quote :
What happens when you discover who you really are—and realize you never wanted to know that soul-wrenching truth? Nightfall and Redlance lead a band of Wolfriders to try to learn the answer...

I kinda guessed they'd lead the band of Wolfriders because Cutter might be unable to lead. I never once imagine that they'd actually be looking for Cutter.
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Mon Nov 30, 2015 2:27 pm

I love Cutter in this issue: his response, his need to separate, not just from Timmain but from everyone who knows his soul name. Others knowing it through Recognition he could deal with: it's part of the Wolfrider Way. But someone who's been lurking inside him, who knows his private thoughts -- in a way not even Recognized partners would -- who blithely announces "Not if, you are!" and acts surprised that he's surprised at this still?

Hell, yeah, I'd be getting the fuck away from her, too!
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Miscellaneous

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Mon Nov 30, 2015 3:11 pm

Me too. This issue had me interested in character I usually don't care for. Cutter. Timmain, because there's the possibility that she's made a mistake and because she's shown as vulnerable. I'm actually worried for her. And Rayek. p 16:
Spoiler:
 
Because I knew it meant troubles when he said that. Nice picture too.
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Elwing

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Mon Nov 30, 2015 3:57 pm

How endlessly boring Elfquest would be without Rayek making wrong decisions for well intended reasons. Which is why he still stands as my favourite character in this whole mess. I like his storyline and I'm interested to see how it will turn out. Hope Venka will be alive at the end of it, but not counting on it.
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:31 pm

@Elwing wrote:
How endlessly boring Elfquest would be without Rayek making wrong decisions for well intended reasons. Which is why he still stands as my favourite character in this whole mess. I like his storyline and I'm interested to see how it will turn out. Hope Venka will be alive at the end of it, but not counting on it.

I was kind of surprised he did that, actually. Seems an awful risk to take. And I admit I was thinking "Uh, dude, who appointed you as guardsman?" But my next thought was "Heh. He did, of course! It's what he does!"

Plus I'm sure he's waaaaay beyond bored just wandering around sniping with Winnie.
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 3:13 pm

Hey- so everyone has read this, right?
http://elfquest.com/the-halfway-mark/?utm_content=bufferfcafc&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

It seems we are right in that the Pinis did not plan Final Quest from the start. They conceived and wrote it in the mid 1990s. Hence, I guess, some of the inconsistencies with the Original Quest.

This would have been around the time of Kings of the Broken Wheel, but, I think, pre-Shards and pre-Hidden Years. So Shards, Dreamtime, Hidden Years, Future Quest, etc would all have been written and drawn with Final Quest in mind. (I'm assuming... probably not Wild Hunt thought.) I wonder if Wendy, though, intended for a character like Tier to exist. Maybe postponing Ember's recognition-- which was about to happen when Wild Hunt stalled-- was her way of reconciling the existence of Tier and his established role in Ember's life with her Final Quest plans for Ember?

I also find this article curious because, in it, Wendy says that the story will "lay our souls bare and reflect absolutely everything we care about in life: dark and light, horrible and humorous." That's a tall order-- but it makes the story interesting on a different level than simply the story itself. If she is being honest in this article, and I can't see why she wouldn't be, then Wendy is revealing her values and what she considers most important in life through the Final Quest storyline. This gives us a whole other way to look at the story, beyond the characters and plot. It's a way of looking at how the author has grown and changed since conceiving this project.

Given that, I'd love to hear what you guys think the story is trying to say so far?

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:30 pm

@Lunakat wrote:
It seems we are right in that the Pinis did not plan Final Quest from the start. They conceived and wrote it in the mid 1990s. Hence, I guess, some of the inconsistencies with the Original Quest.

Didn't they plan simply the Original Quest from the start?
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:33 pm

What do you mean, Redhead, plan simply the OQ? I'm not sure I understand the statement.


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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:41 pm

That could be because I briefly lost the ability to English...

What I meant was that I think I read/heard somewhere that at first they were only planning on writing the OQ.
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:44 pm

To answer Lunakat:

In the OQ, one of the thing I got from the story was that the wolfriders were more... balanced? than the other elves, because they were both from the spirit world and from the animal world. That's how I read it then.

But now we have elves like Moonshade who don't want to be of two worlds anymore. Or Elves like Shenshen who seems to want what Moonshade doesn't want: be of this world.

It seems that they can't keep on following their old ways (Moonshade and Strongbow unable to find a compromise, Ember struggling to follow the way, too much change...) Moonshade and Strongbow seems to be a mirror of a possible splitting of the paths for all of them. A bigger "change or die" than in their past.

And Cutter... It's like he got to accept that Tam is a lot more than Cutter. Big identity crisis.

Hmmm... Maybe it's about choosing the new parameters for their lives. The new limits.
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:53 pm

@Redhead Ember wrote:
That could be because I briefly lost the ability to English...

What I meant was that I think I read/heard somewhere that at first they were only planning on writing the OQ.


Ahhh okay. Well, that would explain a lot then.

I'm actually surprised to hear/read at all that FQ was planned in the 90s, I thought it was planned after 2000.

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:56 pm

@Miscellaneous wrote:

And Cutter... It's like he got to accept that Tam is a lot more than Cutter. Big identity crisis.

Hmmm... Maybe it's about choosing the new parameters for their lives. The new limits.

I'm not sure he accepts that at all yet. When Timmain said she felt the severing or however she put it, it makes me wonder. I'm sure he's maybe in some denial (can't blame him) and I am curious how he's going to handle all of this once they find him.

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 5:06 pm

Yeah, it's not what Cutter would have choosen.

Oh, I don't think I really answered Lunakat question:

Quote :
This gives us a whole other way to look at the story, beyond the characters and plot. It's a way of looking at how the author has grown and changed since conceiving this project.

Given that, I'd love to hear what you guys think the story is trying to say so far?

So: I would say it's about facing the Big Things we would rather not see, and make choices  consequently.
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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 5:36 pm

@Misc-- I think the original story was going for balance. The wolfriders were a result of generations of change that allowed them to reach a point of stability, but their early ancestors were very unstable, swinging wildly between elf/alien and wolf/animal states of being. I always thought the original quest was about finding the balance of your identity- reconcilition with the past and self acceptance. Final Quest is clearly about something else.. But what? Sure, maybe, seeing things you didn't want to see-- but what are those things?

@Ember-- yes. They planned the original quest at the start but not the final quest-- this they planned in the 1990s (according to Wendy)


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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 6:10 pm

Maybe it's just a reinforcement that regardless of whatever balance they find, they don't belong on this planet they're on? I mean Timmain seems to keep mentioning leaving and all of that and who's going to be steering the palace basically. And where are they going to go then, since they're not staying? Going to another planet/star to live? It just seems like the time is drawing closer and FQ seems to be all about choices of who's staying and who's going.

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PostSubject: Re: The Love of Final Quest   Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:13 pm

@Lunakat wrote:
Given that, I'd love to hear what you guys think the story is trying to say so far?

I think it's trying to be about the tension between the larger truth and the smaller, between the cosmic/spiritual and the physical. There is a oneness that lies behind all that is, an underlying structure we can only see in glimpses even as it shapes our lives -- but at the same time, every sentient being is also a world unto itself, and that also matters, and profoundly.


Last edited by ErinC1978 on Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:55 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : didn't mean to poop on the love thread, sorry!)
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