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 So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...

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Lunakat

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Sun Apr 17, 2016 4:31 pm

I don't think this thread is getting aggressive or out there-- not anything we need to 'reel in.' It's a conversation. People sometimes disagree in conversations. I think we can disagree without personally attacking each other. I haven't seen any personal attacks here against anyone on this forum-- and I don't know why we would need to reel in anything else. I think sharing our opinions about the old scroll or the Pinis is fair game-- since we were all there, it's the reason we are all here, and it was public.

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Sun Apr 17, 2016 4:33 pm

ok, Luna. Thanks for the input

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Lunakat

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Sun Apr 17, 2016 4:35 pm

Sure thing, Nibblet!

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Sun Apr 17, 2016 7:07 pm

I think KindredSoul and Lunakat are both right about it. The words could with a certain tone imply aggression or anger, but I don't hear that tone when I read the posts made in the last couple of pages. If anything, I hear frustration and here and there a bit of grief at having lost something significant to them, thus the frustration afterwards. I can see where KindredSoul is coming from, though, as with a different tone the conversations in the last couple of pages might have used a bit of toning-down.

As for what tone was actually used, I think things as I can see them seem to be quite civil, if I've any business in saying so. I'm glad KindredSoul spoke up, as was the responsible thing to do on being concerned by what she saw in the posts. Her own response via Nibblet's posting above was itself unaggressive and consummately considerate.

Damn, but I feel proud to be in a place like this, where people care about each other, even when they're at odds like this. I don't think I've been a part of an active Forum beforehand- at least not in a very long time- where this kind of sustained and mutual respect was both standard issue and fostered between users old and new. Thank you all for proving the worth of my being part of this place. Hugs all around!

-2Paw.

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Sun Apr 17, 2016 7:52 pm

Well said, Two Paw! Bear

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Sun Apr 17, 2016 10:03 pm

As I said earlier. We should all treat each other as we would like to be treated. It would solve many problems. It is not side stepping racism in any way or whatever moniker you want to give it. As a whole society does tend to treat those who are different from them differently. Racism is only the tip of the iceberg. I have multiple birth defects and have to work twice as hard to do things that others do with ease. This translates into every aspect of my life. The biggest headache I deal with is employment. I have to prove I can do the job, while being treated as if I'm incapable of doing anything, and with little to no support from the employer. Stevie Wonder had the right of it. We need to make sure all have equality, no matter our abilities (paraphrased).

As for the SoC. I was sadden by the way things were handled. We should have been given notice of the change and that would have allowed those with work on the site to retrieve their stuff. I have meet the Pini's and although friendly, they both are rather standoffish and quiet. in short I was somewhat impressed, but not overly so.


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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:07 am


To further answer as to why Wendy Pini's hypocrisy, well, first off, let's imagine that racism is not a filthy word. Let's see racism as what it really is, a system of disadvantages brought about by prejudice, that can be perpetuated by our refusal to examine when and how we participate in it. In this, we can understand how our unexamined actions can be motivated by subconscious racism, rather than seeing it as a stereotype of an old white man in a plaid shirt, planning the next KKK meeting.

Wendy "knows" she can't be racist. She's a good person!

Well, maybe she is(I have my doubts), but that doesn't mean she lacks the capacity to act on the same subconscious societal biases that anyone else can.

This means she can understand that a white passing Jewish woman shouldn't play an Asian character, but she's unable to see how her portrayal of Indigenous Americans as either bloodthirsty monsters or worshipful innocents plays on the ignoble/noble savage stereotypes, both of which serve to dehumanize indigenous peoples worldwide.
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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:10 am

I understand the sentiment you were trying to express, Golden. And you are right-- in that that really is the way people should behave toward each other. It's just that (and I think this is why Kathleen was reacting) that is exactly what some people say (in other contexts) to shut down conversations about racism or similar problems with discrimination. And it tends to irk people who want to talk about these things.

I've heard it said that, in this culture (aside from Stevie Wonder who was literally blind!), only white people can really choose to "not see color"-- they have the luxury of that because they will never be subjected to institutionalized or systemic racism. That's what's called "white privilege" and only white people never have to think about it. In the same way that people who are able bodied never have to think about things like... say, walking into a public building that has stairs, or reaching up to get something off a shelf in a supermarket, or using a tight bathroom stall, being able to drive, etc.. Also a type of privilege.

We all tend to see the things that affect us, and be blind to the things that don't affect us.

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:12 am

@kathleen3.0 wrote:

This means she can understand that a white passing Jewish woman shouldn't play an Asian character, but she's unable to see how her portrayal of Indigenous Americans as either bloodthirsty monsters or worshipful innocents plays on the ignoble/noble savage stereotypes, both of which serve to dehumanize indigenous peoples worldwide.

Right, because one is blatantly obvious and the other is subtle. And because she is a good person-- but this is an element of the cultural myths she was fed and grew up with. We don't see these things the way a fish doesn't see the water it swims in. To have them pointed out is jarring.

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PostSubject: Re: So they've basically killed the Scroll of Colors forum...   Sat Apr 23, 2016 2:39 pm

i'm always pretty willing to talk about things that happened, but i usually prefer seeing the truth in between both sides when i can. but i do firmly believe in the "treat others how you would like to be treated." i'm nice to people from the start, i'm willing to give first to get, but this only lasts so long.

if someone won't/can't respect me, why should i extend that courtesy to them?

also omg leanan, huge kudos for saying that to wendy...i'm astounded. that took a lot of courage.
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