Search found 84 matches for 11

It would fit with the scene in #11 where Leetah was alone and thinking how much she just wanted to stay on the WoTM with Cutter forever. But if they were lifemates in your dream, then maybe not.

Going to try and do some positive and negative things about this issue.

So that we can end on a positive note - let's tackle the negative. Mostly because it's the first thing in this issue.

The Negative:
So there it is. Confirmation of my worse nightmare. It turns out that Timmain _is_ actually a part of Cutter, having used a portion of her soul to enter the moment of conception between Joyleaf and Bearclaw. For me, it feels like this cheapens the character of Cutter considerably. When Timmain made this announcement in issue #11, I was hoping it was not literal. But more of, "Hey, I am you because you're generations of my blood." But no. They went with the literal. And this saddens me. And then it's all hamfisted - with Kahvi's comment of "I'll see you in the Palace", to Rayek's comment about candles, to Leetah's "We are one" with the water...

Something I don't understand, is Timmain alludes that Leetah knew this secret. So when Cutter bolts by them, wouldn't it be logical, since she did send to Cutter as he was running by, using his soul name - that she might have glimpsed what was "wrong" with him - especially since she apparently knew this secret? (And this bugs me, if she did know this secret all along, it seems unlike Leetah to have kept this from Cutter).

Now I am not a big fan of the Wavedancers, so they already have that mark against them. And a lot of this next bit has to do with what little I know about Reef as a character - but his "change" into that "sea creature" shape just didn't do it for me. I don't see how that's a "finished" version of his broken self... So perhaps someone could shed some light on that and change my view of this shape changing thing he did?

While I love the art; there's a few spots here where I wasn't sold. For example, when Auroree and Windkin first arrive (in the panel with Redlance and Nightfall) - Auroree looks a little off. Also, all the females in ElfQuest now have this size 0 waist line. I remember when Leetah and Nightfall used to have some meat on their bones, and the Size 0 Waistline was reserved for like Dewshine. But now, the bodies of all the females look exactly the same. Also Treestump, in the panel with Skywise and Ember, when they're discussing Cutter knowing the troll caves - Treestump seems to have lost his more, square, jagged face. He no longer looks like one of the tribe elders; but rather, now he looks like Mender (in the face) with a long beard. Treestump's more "elder" look appears again later with the other elves, when Ember is talking about Scouter helping out Tier.

Dre-Ahn. This character is just not doing it for me. They're writing him "super mysterious" - but for me, I am not feeling it. Because of his lack of speech (both in talking or even sending), this character is like a piece of card board to me. I don't feel anything, because I don't know anything about the character - but everyone else in the comic seems "Ohh and Ahh"'ed by him.

The Trivial (Not A Negative Or Positive) :
It was a bit of a bummer (not really a negative) - that Rayek had no reaction to Cutter having gone missing. Rather zoomed in, instead on the humans attacking the Wavedancers, which he has never had (to my knowledge?) any real connection to. However, you'd think for Leetah (and perhaps to one up Cutter and have Cutter owe him), Rayek would have had SOME reaction to the mention that Cutter has gone missing. Missed opportunity, I think, for Rayek to say at least something about Cutter having gone missing.

While I am glad to see something vile happening to the humans who attacked the fisherman humans, I thought Rayek's outburst and reaction seemed out of character for him. I don't recall Rayek ever caring too much about humans. And it's not Winnowill's will (which would have made more sense, if it had been her reaction with Rayek), since she specifically notes that it's Rayek's anger that has "awakened her from the slumber." So (while I loved Rayek delivering punishment), his initial reaction seemed out of character for him. This would have been (in my opinion) better handled by Winnowill's subconsciousness taking over Rayek, since Winnowill is all too familiar with humans who worshiped the elves.

Throwing this under trivial - while I loved that scene with Cutter on the last page, because it reminds me of when Madcoil came out of his cave - what the heck happened to Cutter's "out reached" hand - the arm perception seems way off to me (it looks like he has a stubby arm).

The Positive:
The art remains fantastic throughout the issue. Especially the scene where Cutter has just fled the Palace and lunges past Suntoucher. That felt like classic, Cutter, lunging pose (almost the same pose I could swear we saw in the original Quest when he lunged at Winnowill).

Now, while I find it a huge Negative about the Cutter and Timmain thing; accepting it for what it is, I do like that Cutter's wolf blood is fighting it and urging him to survive. So if I have to take this story that Timmain is indeed a part of Cutter; I am at least thankful that Cutter seems to be acting like Cutter and fighting to be himself - which I think has always been a defining characteristic of Cutter. So I did like that exchange between Timmain and Aurek for that very thing.

Cutter's departure brings a few characters that have been lingering too long in the background, back up to the foreground - at least for a moment. We finally get to see Redlance and Nightfall a few times, and even have some dialogue.

Strongbow's sending to Mender & the reaction Moonshade has.

I liked seeing Rayek back in "Sun Village" clothing; and more in touch with the colors I recognize him in. However, I wonder why Ahnshen didn't make Ekaur some clothing too? The poor guy is literally in rags, and perhaps the one - of all the elves - in need of some new clothing!

The men of Angrif Djun attacking the human fisherman was a fantastic scene. Especially when you see the difference of these younger men, well armed, well equiped, with armor on going through and slaughtering all these men, women and children - it really shows the evil of these men and it makes you WANT something bad to happen to them. Especially when those two kill that elder with the mermaid necklace. Rayek delivering the punishment was nice - being guided by Winnowill - but I was hoping since Winnowill was the co-pilot we would have seen more out of it - rather than a dark blast and they're dead with holes in their chests. I would have liked to have seen their flesh shaped so they had no nose and mouth (and thus would eventually suffocate, so you see the horror in their eyes) - or something along those lines more in line with what you think Winnowill would do and is capable of.

The end scene with Cutter, completely out of his mind, reminds me of the scene of when Madcoil emerges out of it's cave. Love that.

Trollbabe wrote:

Spoiler for FQ #11....  I hope the latest development in Mender's life means he is maturing.  I really had a problem with "Mender's Tale," when he disguised himself and tricked the human girl.

"Mender's Tale" had an interesting idea but wasn't that well thought through...

@Misc: uhmmm yeah

sun girl wrote:

Just, all these terms being thrown around further up the page such as "guilty" and "attack" and "negative free-fall" and "blood frenzied sharks" seem, like, way too strong to me.

Well since I mentioned the "blood frenzied shark attacks" - figured I would explain. If you look at the initial thread, it's a pretty normal thread. Some positive comments, some negative comments. But by page 7 or so, it was pretty much all negative comments. You had, for example:

Redhead Ember wrote:

I didn't feel I was being attacked per se, just like my attempts at talking positively about FQ was being ignored/twisted to people's negative opinions.

I was probably one of those people. Because as the thread progressed I grew more cynical of the issue; it was, admittedly easier for me, because I saw I was standing in a common area where others were not pleased with the issue (or the run thus far). So when someone said something like, "I wonder if the old human by the lake will come into play" (or something like that), I sarcastically replied, "Calling it now, the old man by the lake was Timmain shape shifted!"

Naturally, I don't actually think that. I was just being a smart ass because of the whole reveal at the end of FQ #11, which didn't shock me, so much as annoy me to Hades and back. And that's just one example. I became increasingly sarcastic in the thread, because someone said they found my comments funny. While, sure the intention is to be "funny" - but that funny was lined with a lot of sarcasm and frustration towards the comic. So while you had people like Redhead Ember above, trying to post positive things, I do not doubt for a moment, I was one of those people, because I was so spun by that point of the thread, that took what she attempted to be a positive response, and replied with an ugly, sarcastic response, making light/jest of her attempts to share what some things she actually enjoyed.

And when you have people spinning elements you find good in something, and you can't have a normal conversation, without someone being a sarcastic arse about your positive comments; it does, indeed, hamper the idea of sharing the things you enjoyed.

Feel better soon, Kin. *hugs*
I hope you had a good day without any aftermath of yesterday's "party", Nibblet! ^^


Got up too early for my taste. Took the train to the bigger town nearby. Looked for an elf shop I couldn't find. Bought some crafts matierial for Christmas stars. Picked my FQ #11 and the German translation of "The Complete Elfquest". (It's reserved for me , therefore no problem to be late for the party.) Bought cat food and shower gel (because I wouldn't havve a chance to buy it when I'm back home).

Train back at noon ... at home one hour later. Resting in preparing to leave for my favorite coffee shop at 2 pm - we had annonced a "crafts workshop" there. Tought a big buy in my age how to fold Christmas stars (Fröbelsterne). Back hone at 7 pm.

Now I'm tiiiiiiired!

Spoiler for FQ #11.... I hope the latest development in Mender's life means he is maturing. I really had a problem with "Mender's Tale," when he disguised himself and tricked the human girl.

Lunakat wrote:

I like that the last issue ended on a bizarre cliffhanger-- of the sort we haven't seen before. I have no idea where this is going, and I like that. I'm sick of humans or Winnowil being the reason for everything-- and they have been lately-- this is different and new.. and I'm for that!

I want to be genuinely surprised.

Yes! The cliffhanger in #11 really was a "whoa shit" moment for me, in a good way, and I'm stoked to see where it's going. This has the potential to take the story in a new and interestingly weird direction.

Am hoping that this will be the turning point, where a lot of the wrapup that's been going on in the last few issues will be largely, well, wrapped up, and we'll start seeing some major forward momentum.

I enjoyed the heck out of listening to these guys taking us on their own personal roller coaster ride through #11.

TrollHammer wrote:

@Redhead Ember: I had to read your entry several times and it still didnt click until rereading #11. Somehow I had forgotten about those two in wrapstuff. Now it all makes sense. Well done!

Yeah, piece of advice when reading my stuff; it might be really obscure.

@Tymber: Wow, you sure pulled back on the reins with that one! Blew away the ongoing major conflict (Humans) and left your tribe open for... whatever! Looking forward to seeing what you have in store for them.

@Redhead Ember: I had to read your entry several times and it still didnt click until rereading #11. Somehow I had forgotten about those two in wrapstuff. Now it all makes sense. Well done!

This is kind of wierd coming from me, as I didnt discover EQ until the mid to late 90s, but EQ has changed over the years, and to a degree I dont feel it was always for the better.  I love the original quest. I live with Wolfrider and Fire and Flight as a defining moment of EQ history (which of course it is, but I mean it as "this is what EQ IS")... reading on through things, even through Shards the feel of the story was pretty close to this standard. EQ2 was one breaking point in the general feel of the universe, but this is explained away with various other writers interjecting their views and interpretations of the story,and as such is forgivable (even though, to this day, I still cant seem to immerse myself in Worldpool and the like as much as I can OQ and Wolfrider) (yes, I understand that Wolfrider may be a compilation produced later, but some of the stories were written during the earlier years).  

I think the break between the 90s and the mid 2000s push (SaS, Disco) may have let WP clear her mind from the ratrace of the 90s, but IMO, it was for the worse. SAS was ok, though the pacing and artwork just didnt have the same feel as the older stuff, but Disco just felt cheesy, like EQ had sold its soul to Disney.  The FQ prequel has its moments of good, but there are still pacing issues and art that just doesnt feel right.  The FQ series is a step farther in this vein.  I said it before that the whole thing feels rushed, like the Pini's were told "ok, we'll print your story, but we can only guarantee it will be printed in its entirety IF you make it fit into 24 issues and dont dwell on the side stuff.  Our readership are all a bunch of ADHD misfits who only buy stuff thats flighty and fast paced, so none of this epic questing stuff you did in the past, get the story going, get it done, and we wont censor you.... much..."  Im not saying this is what did happen, nor do I feel the same way, its just a feeling I've had for a while, and rereading the prequel today seemed to reinforce this.  The prequel feels a lot slower paced and less rushed (though it does jump a bit still). It wasnt until halfway through the prequel that any publisher took notice and committed to publishing anything, and even then it was at the demand that WaRP stop posting the prequel for free... what other constraints did they demand "to make it profitable"?

(Sorry, Im in a wierd state. Feel free to ignore my soap box ramblings)

I will say, though, its not just the publisher as a cause of the changes.  They may have set guidelines (or not, this is all supposition), but WP still has the ultimate control of what gets drawn, and therefore what gets said in the comic.  To a degree, it may be that this is Final Quest as this is a last ditch attempt to get to "an" ending (I mean shoot, if she was 20ish when it started, she's 57ish now... how can someone be the same kind of writer and artist at those two different ages?) (Actually, just looked up wikipedia. Born in 1951... she is currently 61.  Started in 1978 at the age of 27?)  Point being, Im sure she doesnt have the same energy and focus she had back then, or the same opinions as she used to, and she is probably trying to put it to bed.

That said, there isnt any reason to change main staples of the EQ universe.  The healer that was pining away over Ember suddenly has had a seemingly lifelong desire for someone else, and a different gender at that?  Seems more like an agenda than plot development. In this case, it doesnt matter who wanted who in the past. Let the past be the past, develop a new present with a new love interest (or whatever) and let the reader warm to it as the story develops... dont just drop it and say "this is whats happening, and its suddenly been this way for a long time".  Drop agendas and soapboxes, and be a writer!  ( this has been the biggest lesson Ive learned in writing fanfic, because I used to have a plan or goal of what the main characters were going to do three stories down the road... and I was miserable. Ended up not writing for a few years due to burnout trying to jump through the hoops I set for myself.  Once I tossed the hoops, the plan, the outline, and just explored the writing abyss with my fingers via the keyboard, I could finally write again and be happy doing it!)

But possibly she is bound by an outside publisher, and can only do the best she can in the pages allotted.  SaS, Disco, Shards, Wild Hunt, the Prequel and the current series has only covered a span of around 50ish years (give or take, Im really not sure on this). By some reasoning, Future Quest happens another thousand years in the future, with a history that includes (supposedly) Cam Triompe and Jink (which was a concept character in the 70s by WP, so it isnt likely she'll be left out as non canon).  We're about halfway through FQ and we still have a confrontation with a human navy, a resolution of what happens when (if) the palace leaves, a resolution to Winnie's status, and perhaps a birth of Jink.  If Future Quest has any bearing on canon, the trolls still need to colonize the moons and other planets, then abandon them after building domes... far far too much to cover at even the current abbreviated pacing, and it still skips around a lot.


Today, I reread #11, and the thing that kind of bothered me was their commentary on who got there, who hadnt, who died... and the comment about the one who died trying to get there: "then they did make it!"

Uh... Im sorry? What?

If dieing and coming there as a spirit (to fuel the palace?) counts as "making it", then why doesnt "the call" just say "save yourself some time ans drink the kool-aid, wrap a plastic bag over your head, and fall on your spear for good measure, then you dont have to go to any effort fighting humans to get here!"

Embala wrote:

IF Timmain and Tam truely share one soul ... and given the fact that Cutter and Skywise ARE recognized - I's say YES, Timmain and Fahr are recognized for quite some time already.

But that's just my interpretation. Nowhere in #11 it was explicitly mentioned that Skywise and Tiimmain are recognized. It might be implied ... but it was not stated. Your view can be totally right as well, Tymber.

Words will not describe how furious I will be if they go with Timmain and Cutter are one body/soul type thing...

It will literally be the last issue of ElfQuest I pick up.

Ever.

IF Timmain and Tam truely share one soul ... and given the fact that Cutter and Skywise ARE recognized - I'd say YES, Timmain and Fahr are recognized for quite some time already.

But that's just my interpretation. Nowhere in #11 it was explicitly mentioned that Skywise and Tiimmain are recognized. It might be implied ... but it was not stated. Your view can be totally right as well, Tymber.

I picked up #10 last week, and #11 yesterday. Personally, I am getting tired of the endless wrap-ups.

Rayek hasn't seen his parents since when? I get that he doesn't call them "Mum" and "Pops", but they don't respond like the father in Luke 15, who rejoices over the return of the prodigal son. Did they have six other kids?

The last reference I recall of Picknose, Oddbit and Old Maggoty, was a conversation between Drub and Trinket. Drub is Queen, and she orders Trinket to pick up a sword and learn self-defense. I forgot which series and which issue, but it's clear that Picknose and Old Maggoty aren't "here." Now Picknose, Maggoty, Ember and Trinket are somehow together as a royal family again.

At least Ember isn't tied to a chair. But didn't she go ahead and recognize Teir? If so, where are the results?

The EQ FB page is asking what Issue #11 has us wondering.

Has me wondering just what chemical substances Wendy and Richard have been ingesting and just how legal they are...

FQ #11 is the topic. The commentary's interesting this time.

https://soundcloud.com/theelfquestshow

Embala wrote:

I still cannot tell for sure whether Cutter still his facefur ... or whether those are shorter lose strands.

When this drawing was first published Wendy said it wasn't the facefur that was missing. But isn't it curious that just one issue before this cover we see Timmain-Cutter without facefur but with those lose strands around her/his face? Strands that Cutter never had before but which could almost be mistaken for his facefur?
In every other drawing Cutters facefur grows in a clear line under his cheekbones but in this one there is no line....
I'm pretty sure it IS the facefur.
So either it's Timmain on the cover or Tam is going to loose his wolfblood and he'll probably won't be amused.

Funny those reincarnation theories... I read them before #11 appeared and laughed about it but now I'm afraid it could very well be true.
I wouldn't be surprised if Wendy DID have this idea from the start. Remember the first scene in OQ#1 in which we see Cutter and Skywise after we saw two highones with undeniable resemblances to our two hero's?
But I'm sure the idea of Cutter and Timmain came later.
I'm not sure what to think about it right now, I'm just glad SOMETHING interesting is happening... well... I hope it turns out to be interesting.

Useful thread: A Breakdown of What's What by Skya



My Try of a Reader's Guide

It's not "the ultimative reader's guide" but good enough for a smooth read. I'll give you some information about the different series so you can decide by yourself.


Original Quest
Siege at Blue Montain
King of te Broken Wheel
Dreamtime - happens shortly after the return of the Palace ... awesome Wendy art
Hidden Years #4, #8, #9,5 and #10-15 - single issues filling gaps and giving background information for the time from the return of the Palace until the main story lines SHARDS and HIDDEN YEARS start. Read before starting with Shards and the rest of HY!

Main storyline - Shards (#1 til #15) and Hidden Years (from #16 til the end) - run parallel and influence each other.
Shards #10 / HY #24 and Shards #12 / HY #25 are directly connected - read the Shards issue before you look in the corresponding HY issue - spoiler warning!

About same time as Shards and Ember's Hidden Years storyline
New Blood #14-35 - Forevergreen Arc ... no direct connections with Shards/HY but it has necessary informations about the Sunvillagers' and Windkin's fate.
Would be no fault to read New Blood #11, #12, #13 before you start the Forevergreen Arc with NB #14.

Shards #16 gathers both the three story lines and the scattered elves.

Here you should read In All But Blood - it starts with Cutter's youth, a story about his early time in the Sunvillage, a story centering on Skywise somewhen after the return of the Palace. The last is the important one: Full Circle closes a time and knowledge gap between the end of SHARDS and the following stories ...

The Searcher and the Sword - following Cutter's tribe after Shards
Discovery - follows directly SatS

... that's what would make most sense for me to read in row from EQ1 until "present time" (= The Final Quest)


NOT on Digital EQ:
The Final Quest Prologue
Final Quest #1-24


more or less parallel with SatS / Discovery
Wild Hunt - following Ember's tribe after the Shards War
Mender's Tale (unfinished) - follows Wild Hunt
Recognition (Summer Special) - continues Wild Hunt
partly retold and more or less retconed by the Final Quest #1-2

The Forevergreen Story arc is more or less continued by
Worldpool - following some chars from the Forevergreen Arc - and
Fire-Eye (unfinished)
both probably "non-canon"



Other series and single issues

Tales from the Elves' wild past
Blood of Ten Chiefs
Two-Spear
Wolfrider! - read it!
By any other name (in the Readers Collection "In all but Blood")
Hidden Years #5, #6, #7, #9
#5 Starfall, Starrise - pre-EQ1 (story about Skywise and his parents' fate)
#6/7 How Shall I keep from Singing - High Ones' arrival and first years
#9 The Enemy's Face - story from Leetah's birth and youth
Homespun (in the Readers Collection "In all but Blood")

Spotlights on the time of the Long Wait (disappearance of the Palace until Big Sleep)
Hidden Years #1, #2, #3
#1 Wolfwood - during Long Wait (centering on Strongbow - I love it)
#2 Going Back - during Long Wait (Kahvi "visits" Sorrow's End again)
#3 Little Patch - during Long Wait (Tyleet's "cub")
The Jury (?)
New Blood #11, #12, #13
Kahvi

Background story of the Wavedancers
Wavedancers Issue #1
Wavedancers
Wavedancers - lost chapters (unfinished)
... it might be less puzzeling to read it after Discovery (some inconsistencies and retconning)

----------------

Somewhen in not too far future
Rogue's Curse - following Rayek's journey after Shards/Final Quest

Far future
Jink
The Rebles
Futurequest (unfinished)

--------------

I have not listed EVERYTHING here!

The rest of New Blood is a mix of Wild Past, Long Wait, various Misc stuff ... many of it considered non-canon

same for Bedtime Stories

Elfquest Volume 2 - containes stories that are mostly listed and reposted in collections (ask if you want to know more ... same for stories I missed to mention)

Kings Cross - a "What-If" / alternative universe story ...

Xanth - something totally different



There is no easy way to read through - you'll have to pick when you want to follow the timeline.

As you will notice some of the stories can be found in several topics. The Elfquest Vol. 2 issues have several ongoing stories in each issue - and then and now a single one. Many of these stories are gathered in collections:

Dreamtime, Wild Hunt, Wavedancers, Rogue's Curse, Wolfrider! to mention just a few.

You can stick with the gatherings to follow my suggestions ... Elfquest Vol. 2 is a read for completation when everything else is done in my opinion.


Don't hesitate to ask in case you need more information - or help to find some issues/collections.


Welcome to the pack Enjoy and have fun! Good read!

It just occured to me - the missing "build up" of the Mender-Dart relationship that was often complained about in the #11 thread ...
We got it!

Yeah, Moonshade's story is resonating with me, and I feel it's been reasonably well crafted.

Lunakat wrote:

The posing too is, off and on, pretty stiff. If you look at the art from the original quest, Wendy, rather brilliantly, drew her characters as if they were in motion. Every single time. Even if they were standing still, there was a turn to the head, a motion of a hand, a twist to the body, etc. Now, they often just stand, lined up, in these stiff poses, like people posing for a camera or positioned onstage. It's awkward and create, in the story, a stiff, awkward feeling for me as a reader.'

Yeah, I agree completely -- compare the naturalistic action depicted in the opening scene of the Go-Back orgy and the dance welcoming the Wolfriders to Sorrow's End to the party celebrating Korafay's birth. The first two look like actual moments from an actual party. The third... doesn't.

And one of the frustrating things is the inconsistency. Granted, not every panel of any given comic is going to be equally awesome (though Book 4 of the OQ came pretty damn close to that standard), but the thing is, at least some of the time she can still do it. Some panels are lovely and then others are generic copypasta. Like, I adore page 15 of #11, all of it, but especially the lovely naturalism of the upper left panel. But then, on the very next page, Leetah's expression does NOT work, because it's barely modified from the scene in Final Quest Special when she was so excited to see Windkin. And in the panel below her everybody's standing stiffly on stage again, facing the camera. Sigh.

Ok just finished reading #11.

For the most part. It turned out like I thought it would. Then I get to the end with Cutter and Timmain. WTF!!!! I swear after reading that the first thing that popped into my head was...

" When the moon is in the seventh house, and Jupiter aligns with Mars. Then Peace will guide the planets, and love will fill the stars. This is the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius."

I tried to hide this, but here's spoiler space just in case
[

[

[

[hide]Hi Everyone!  Long time lurker (migrated here with everyone else after the SoC debacle) and...Issue #11 has finally put me over the top.  Reading Final Quest has been like watching a lovely antique car get mowed down by a train in slow-motion.  It's hard to overstate how big an impact the original quest had on my development as a writer and artist.  I wish I could stop reading Final Quest, but I love the characters enough that I want to see what happens to them.  There's just enough beautiful art and familiarity to keep me coming back with each new issue.  

Wendy's facility with the digital medium has improved tremendously since the days of Masque (good lord, that was ugly).  From time to time she can still hit it out of the park.  There is, however, a pervasive inconsistency in how she draws the characters now.   Very often, they don't look like quite themselves.  Example: Sunstream on p. 14--there's just something slightly off about him (it's not a terrible egregious example, there have been worse.)  I also can't stand the "composite" panels, where she's clearly using templates of the characters and just moving their limbs around.  Korafay, Brill, Sunstream, Snakeskin, and Moonshade in the palace are a good example from this issue.  I think they were all recycled images, and they never quite look like they're really occupying the space.

The Moonshade/Strongbow story...the bones of this subplot are actually pretty good, but it's been dragged out so long that a lot of the energy has seeped out of it.  I feel like we've been building to this scene of crisis for too long, but the moment still pays off pretty well.  The panel in which Moonshade approaches Strongbow flanked by Skywise and Leetah reads quite creepy to me.  They look like Stepford Wives ("Join us.....")  I get where Moonshade is coming from--she's outgrown the simplicity of wolfrider life and longs for a larger reality.  She's at an impasse with Strongbow because he's still perfectly satisfied with the way things were.  In real life, they'd probably separate, and I kind of like that the series is exploring that.  But Strongbow's anger and dismay also seems perfectly justified.  Moonshade isn't the elf he loves anymore--the elf who appreciated the beauty of the forest, who loved her wolf-friends, who relished the hunt and howl.  That elf is totally, irrevocably gone (right down to the genetic level!), and while that was her choice, that doesn't mean that he has anything in common with the new Moonshade.  She might as well be dead.  Cutter gets it immediately, and I love that he directs a pointed comment at Skywise and Leetah, the two people who have been waiting for him change his own mind.  But I think he drew the wrong conclusion.  The problem isn't that, by waiting for Cutter to become immortal, Skywise and Leetah are "giving up everything that's good for them."  It's that they want and expect everyone to come around to their point of view. They have not made their peace with the fact that a variety of choices can be equally valid.  And with this issue, Skywise has become even more superior and sanctimonious than ever.  

I despise Timmain.  Despise.  I think she's the manifestation of everything that's problematic in Final Quest.  She's just a fount of omnipotent mumbojumbo.  I don't want her and Cutter to be two bodies with one soul.  That would just tie the most complex, well-developed character in the whole series to the most abstract, infuriating character.  

My hope: that Timmain proves to be a liar and a villain.  She certainly reads as profoundly sinister, at least to me.  So high-handed, so imperious.  Maybe her tryst with Skywise was supposed to seem "magical" and "romantic," but to me, it looked like she bopped his brains out--literally!  All of a sudden, he's spouting off about racial purity and how "the healers have to make everyone immortal..." Wow.  Disturbing.  And it seems like she actually brings it out of him.  He's laying there all sated on page 12 (lovely top panels, by the way), and all of a sudden she looms over him.  Then he starts talking about how none of the elves should have a choice about whether to stay or go, and her only response is a cryptic smile.  *shudder*  And afterwards, when he talks to Leetah, he looks sort of drugged.  Skywise (paraphrase): "I just feel so alive, man!"

So when Timmain drops her bomb on Cutter...yeah, I just hope she's full of wolf dung.  My fear, however, is that Timmain is not intended to be evil.  In fact, I've had some strong suspicions about Wendy's intentions throughout Final Quest, and I figure it's time to throw them out there.  

I don't believe Wendy and Richard had any of this planned during the Original Quest.  I don't think the Timmain we met after the palace war was this version of the character.  Sure, they can hand-wave the inconsistencies by having Timmain explain that she "didn't fully remember herself" after being a wolf for so long.  Whatever. I mostly get the feeling that Wendy's absorbed some "New Age" ideas over the years, and decided to take Final Quest in a metaphysical direction because those are concepts she's interested in exploring in the text.  Fair enough.  I've had some exposure to those types of ideas (which is why I'm pretty sure I can recognize them), and I can say that, ostensibly, they seem like they could be explored in a fantasy context very effectively.  It's a bad idea, however.  High-concept conceits (like those that are cluttering up Final Quest) are basically inert plotwise.  They're easy to "tell," hard to "show."  As a reader, there's only so much satisfaction I can get out of a discussion of imaginary metaphysics.  I can only attach to characters, and these characters (whom I've loved for over 20 years,) are just...boring.  Drained of excitement.  Cutter has literally done nothing for 11 issues.  Other than Strongbow and Moonshade (whose plot thread, as I said, has been extremely slack,) how many of our beloved wolfriders have done anything of note in FQ?  Instead, we're following a ton of secondary characters without the nuance or development of the classic characters.  I just can't be bothered to care what happens to Snakeskin or Korafay or Windkin.  I don't really know them (I mindwiped Forevergreen....)

Assorted other observations:

--Windkin's new...membrane is absurd.  It looks so flimsy and wibbly, I don't believe it would improve his flying speed at all (isn't that why Glider-Tyldak asked Winnowill to give him wings in the first place?)  He was way better off with his engineered wings. At least those looked aerodynamic.

--I don't mind the Dart/Mender relationship.  Both characters have been deployed to more compelling effect elsewhere, but they aren't too bad in Final Quest.  But I'm not sure I get what they really see in each other?  Dart has been suspicious of Mender's bloodlust (which makes sense given his traumatic backstory.)  Is Mender attracted to Dart simply because he's an attractive cipher?  Or because he wants a lifemate?  I'll keep an open-mind and hope that more interesting things unfold in their storyline.

--I seriously have no idea what the point was of "making everyone come to the palace."  How cruel and useless did that turn out to be?  We ended up with a mute (albeit a relatively cool-looking one), and two poor b@$#ards in wrapstuff. That's it after years of waiting?  The rest of the elves must realize what a boring plot-killer the palace is, and decided to keep away!

--I swear that in the preview for #11, there was a panel in which Moonshade offers the naked Timmain a cloak or blanket.  Moonshade is wearing her leathers.  I noticed that a page later, Moonshade was back in the palace in her flowing dress.  It irritated me when I saw it, because it seemed like a sloppy continuity error.  In the actual issue, there's no scene of Moonshade giving Timmain a blanket.  I wonder if someone noticed the inconsistency and made a tweak?  Or was I just hallucinating??

--Seeing Aurek in Orolin's old seat made me really sad.  That character has spent his entire life either entranced or alone.  It's just...horrible to contemplate.  And I get that "the elves are different, they aren't human."  But do you really think, say, Nightfall would look at his fate and think it's a good thing?  I don't.

Anyway, sorry for such a crazy first post.  I just needed to get this stuff off my chest.  I'm not sure I was even able to articulate everything that rubs me the wrong way about Final Quest, but at least it's a start.

Little Patch ... this was Little Patch's thread, opened by Bugwort, on the original Scroll of Colors. Follow old discussions and see fanart from earlier times. #11 found

Visit Little Patch's bio page on Elfquest.com.#11 found

Here, for reference, I shall gather and present the exact and distinct scenes of magic-use, up to 'The Discovery'.
I will show only the scenes drawn by Wendy, because her work should have precedence..
..and because they are necessarily 'canon'.


Original Quest - #1 :
: Gliding (High One)
: Sending (Wolf Send)
: Sending (Group Send : call)
: Sending (Group Send : Sharing a vision

Original Quest - #2 :
: Sending (Individual call)
: Recognition
: Hypnotic trance (on elf)
: Emotion feeling
: Healing
: Light control

Original Quest - #3 :
: Very probable shape-changing magic highly charged on object (the 'Great Sun' item behind Savah shows changing patterns) - possible mind manipulation
: Levitation (on object)
: Hypnotic trance (on animal)
: Levitation (on animal)
: Possible Truth-telling
: Mind Probe
: Information : self-levitation was thought to be a lost power, among the Sun Folk

Original Quest - #4 :
: Sending (Dark Send)
: Possible emotion control (or more)
: Information : Magic can stagnate and turn into a monstruosity
: Magic monster (COMBINING powers)
: Sending (Special, intense, intimate call)
: Sending (Special call, by monster)
: Probable Watching over (by a dead elf, over a living one)
: Resistance to Dark Send

Original Quest - #5 :
: Plant Growth
: Soul Name
: Telescopic Vision
: Mind Control (on animal, pretended
: Mind Control (on animal, confirmed)
: Mind Search + Visual Projection + Voice Projection (probable - or a special form of Sending)

Original Quest - #6 :
: 'Going Out'
: Plant Control + Magic Feeling
: Sending (Lock-Send - Challenge

Original Quest - #7 :
: Tree Shaping
: Sending (from elf to wolf)

Original Quest - #8 :
: Magic Feeling (faint - familiar setting)
: Magic Feeling (confirmed - non familiar setting)
: Mental Link
: Mental Guiding

Original Quest - #9 :
: Magic Feeling (confirmed)

Original Quest - #10 :
: Magic of the preservers' cocoons
: Sending (Special, intimate, intense call - confirmed)
: Sending (Calling back images)
: Possible premonition
: Locked warning
: Preservers: a magically created species
: Sending (Dark Send - Torture)
: Tree Shaping (living wood into an object)

Original Quest - #11 :
: Sending (Dark Send - Stun)
: Rock Shaping (dedicated - Door effect)
: Sending (Dark Send - Piercing back)
: Sending (Group call to one)
: Anti-Healing
: Sending (Dark Send - multi-targetted) + Leetah's remark on anti-healing
: Gliding (Blue Mountain's Gliders)
: Sending (Dark Send - Kill)
: Healing (as an improvised Shield)
: Probable Prying on Sendings

Original Quest - #12 :
: Information : Locked Warning is mainly made of visual elements and feelings
: Information : Shaping and Healing are basically the same type of magic
: Semi-dead state Lethargy - used to enforce dedication of magic (here: VERY dedicated and limited Rock Shaping task)
: Flesh Shaping
: Sending (Lock Send)
: Sending (Intense, focussed, forcing)

Original Quest - #13 :
: Information : Going Out comes with deadly risks
: Emotion Feeling or more
: Sending (Deep Sending)
: Soul Name abuse
: Probable HARD metal Shaping
: Information : Ancient types of magic
: Combined magic : Rock Shaping + Levitation (complex, dedicated, + History effect)
: Information : Symbolic and memory effect, for the Egg
: Information : Magical semi-dead Lethargy helped by a potion
: Information : Healing tells much about genetics
: Resistance to Dark Send (killing version)
: Complete Self-Shaping (Plant - High One)
: Complete Self-Shaping (animal - High One) + Magically induced INTER-BREEDING
: Information : Probable Mind Manipulation

Original Quest - #14 :
: Information : Recognition reveals the soul
: Sending (Dark Send) - Mind Control (Oblivion)
: Going Out (Spirit Capture)
: Sending and Going Out (Spirit Seeking)
: Flesh Shaping (on animal)
: Tree Shaping (turning strangleweed vines into a living trap)
: Plant Control
: Going Out (Mind Touch)
: Healing (Mental Healing)
: Probable Near-Death Auto Healing

Original Quest - #15 :
: Open Sending (Sharing a vision)
: Magic Aura (Visual Detection of magic)
: Exchange of Soul names

Original Quest - #16 :
: Watching Over (confirmed)
: Magic Feeling
: Hypnotic Trance (on troll)
: Gliding (rough version)

Original Quest - #17 :
: Gliding (floating someone else at distance)
: Call of the Palace (confirmed)
: Possible Premonition
: Soul Name offering
: Possible Premonition (preserver)
: Gliding (heavy charge)
: Possible Hard Metal Shaping ('fusing metal to stone')

Original Quest - #18 :
: Rock Shaping (combined to shape the Palace's stone)
: Stone Feeling

Original Quest - #19 :
: Sending (Link)
: Gliding (lifting extreme weight)

Original Quest - #20 :
: Forced Recognition
: Spirit Feeling (High One)
: Information : Dead elf spirits choose or not where they go
: Information : those born out of Recognition attract interested spirits
: Extreme Longevity (preservers)
: Mind Linking + Visual Effects + Preserver cocoon's Think-Do + support by the 'Scroll' item, heavily charged with magic
: Information : Source and nature of magic
: Going Out (High Ones)
: Information : Origin of the Palace, of trolls and of preservers
: Preserver cocoon's Think-Do effect + 'out of time' effect
: Mental Link (from afar)


Siege at Blue Mountain - #1 :
: Possible Resistance to the Palace's call of dead spirits
: Power absorption (with the Egg as a support)

Siege at Blue Mountain - #2 :
: Sending Detection (long range)
: Mental Submission (by use of the Soul Name)
: Mind Probe (by the use of Mind Touch)
: Gliding (while asleep!)

Siege at Blue Mountain - #3 :
: Dark Send while Going Out!

Siege at Blue Mountain - #4 :
: Mental Healing (calming down)
: Information : magic is asleep in humans
: Genetic Change

Siege at Blue Mountain - #5 :
: Concentrating magic into an item
: Magic Feeling (in humans!)
: Gliding (very probably even inside cocoons!)
: Genetic Change (confirmed - with limits)
: Power Concentration (huge rock-shaping + floating)
: Gathering Power (Sending - demonstrating Dark Send)

Siege at Blue Mountain - #6 :
: Sending (gliders - strange limitation - preservers' cocoons)
: Sending Analysis (emotions)
: Possible information on magic - Control may be linked with need
: Same Soul for two bodies (possible reality / probable Mind Control trick)
: Tree Shaping - Anti-fire effect (+ effect of love on magic)

Siege at Blue Mountain - #7 :
: Mind Control trick (more probable)
: Egg as a memory holder (like the Scroll of colors - confirmed)
: Effect of will on group magic (focus)
: Mental Healing (emotions and need)
: What group magic can accomplish
: Egg meant to ABSORB the Palace, the elf spirits inside it, and their power
: Space and time travel (group magic)

Siege at Blue Mountain - #8 :
: Mind Control trick (confirmed)
: Group magic versus one (+ interesting remark: 'they KNOW her')
: Truth in Sending (Wolfrider savagery)
: Mental Healing (waking powers up)
: Healing (BOTH human and elf, at the same time!)
: Information : interesting after-effect
: Spirit Hosting
: The only difference is love (probable key for magic)


Kings of the Broken Wheel - #1 :
: Magic causes strange genetic effects
: Magic Feeling (by preservers)
: Fire Magic (Heat Wave - Group magic - by GLIDERS!)
: Floating (used for stopping the huge bolt) + EXTREME STRENGTH (manipulating that heavy bolt) (Group magic)
: Fire magic (Bolts - group magic - gliders or linked to Rayek)
: Shield (group magic)
: Mental Link + specific event near the Palace = triggering of a special effect

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #2 :
: Information : Timmain has more powerful fire magic than group
: Fire Magic (HUGE energy bolts - causing a huge chasm - group magic
: Freeing the dead gliders' spirits restores the Palace

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #3 :
: Shape Changing (High One - inside a preserver cocoon - confirmed as incredible feat)
: Sending (from far away and intensely so)
: Flying (Palace power)
: Reintegrating even an unwilling High One (Palace power)
: Extreme Velocity Travel (Palace power)
: Emotion Transfer (Spirits power)
: Emotion Transfer (confirmed + Interesting remark: dead elves barely remember, even recent and extreme events, like murder!

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #4 :
: Waking powers up (Palace power)
: Magic Vision (Palace power)
: Mind Control (forced sleep)
: Healing (another use of magic.. *sigh*)
: Rock Shaping (..the Palace - not so difficult, now!)
: Sending the Cry out (inside the Palace)
: Rock Shaping (..the Palace - SEPARATING a piece of it!)
: Disguising the Palace (interesting 'A PART of the new land' call..)

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #5 :
: Mind Transfer
: Mental Healing (Shutting mental door)
: Shield (Palace-induced power)
: Palace-induced effects
: Water Control (Winnowill - so soon after her exile on that island!)

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #6 :
: Magic Feeling (Extreme: Hearing a mental cry from beyond time!)
: Light Control (visual effects - Scroll magic)
: Link with the little Palace
: Mind Link (from afar) + Water Breathing (so soon after her exile on that island!)
: Time Jump (Palace power)

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #7 :
: Mental Call (Extreme)
: Mental Shield
: Lock Sending (facilitating birth - without a healer)
: Mental Shield (confirmed and developped)

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #8 :
: Rock Shaping (Determining a mountain's aging)
: Anti-Healing (driven by hatred)
: Healing (a human - leprosis-like terminal disease)
: Anti-healing (controlled)
: Genetic Change (removing the wolf blood from a wolfrider)
: Escaping Mind Link and Sending

Kings of the Broken Wheel - #9 :
: Water Surge
: Water Swirl
: Water Ram
: Mental Shield (Evolved into Mental Barriers and Mental Submission)
: Healing (at distance - power of love + Palace)
: Time Jump (back in time - Palace power)

Hidden Years #1:
: Premonition (not even watching the target!)

Hidden Years #2:
: Fire magic (Creating flames)

Hidden Years #4:
: Rock Shaping (Bridge - Palace power)
: Detecting humans around (Palace power)
: Winnowill in hypnotic trance and entrapped within the Palace's walls
: Fragments of the Palace (lost..)
: Healing (at distance - many at once - combined powers + Palace effect)

Hidden Years #5:
: Recognition (Mental Link effect)

Hidden Years #9½:
: Winnowill shaken out of her trance by Cutter's hating send
: Sending.. as the most adequate punishment ever!


Shards #16:
: Soul Entrapment
: Watching Over (visually confirmed)


The Searcher and the Sword:
: Sending (Complete Imagery, BY HUMAN)
: Preserver cocoon magic (to LEARN from the Palace)
: Deal elf spirit Calling (confirmed)


The Discovery:
: Magic Channelling (confirmed) + Learning in preserver cocoon (confirmed)
: Magic Shaping (Palace power)
: Going Out while cocooned and projecting a mental image from afar!
: Information: no hiding emotions while in this..
: Astral Flight (called by love)
: Water Surge
: HUGE spiraling Water Surge!
: Water Rope
: 'Us but not us..' - reminds of Cutter's remarks.. WHAT KIND OF ELF IS WINNOWILL, ACTUALLY!?..
: 'In THOUSANDS of years' !!

Aroree Borealis ... this was Aroree's thread, opened by Kathleen, on the original Scroll of Colors. Follow old discussions and see fanart from earlier times.

Visit Aroree's bio page on Elfquest.com. #11 found