Final Quest #14

Honestly, I don't CARE anymore who lives or dies. And what old friend of Venka's? Does she even have friends, because the Pinis honestly avoided having to explore anymore of her personal history and relationships than they had to, so as far as we know she has no old friends.

Outlier wrote:

I think if somebody bites it, it's gotta be Moonshade. She just chose immortality. Might as well put a target on her.

That wouldn't surprised me at all. Pini seems very fond of killing off the immortal elves.

Outlier wrote:

It should happen in the palace, too, since she thought Abode was too dangerous.

I've been thinking that too. I just went a step further and thought all the elves in the palace are brutally butchered and it's supposed to be read as 'choosing the palace is wrong and they payed the price'.

Outlier wrote:

Venka would be a good choice, too. If Winnowill somehow causes her demise, that would ensure that Rayek never goes near any other elves again.

I'd honestly hope it would finally knock some goddamn sense into his head and cause him to let her go and get on with his life.
But,eh, he's too selfish to do that.

wingthing wrote:

I never thought I'd say this, but I would be so pissed if Moonshade dies immediately. I agree shes almost certainly doomed in the long run, but to kill her off right after the split with Strongbow would read so strongly as "punishment" for breaking his heart.

Don't most fans want to punish her for that tho? Her punishment-death would actually make a bunch of people happy. It would also work to further the whole 'the palace/immortal elves are wrong'-thing.

Shadowpath wrote:

wingthing wrote:

I never thought I'd say this, but I would be so pissed if Moonshade dies immediately. I agree shes almost certainly doomed in the long run, but to kill her off right after the split with Strongbow would read so strongly as "punishment" for breaking his heart.

Don't most fans want to punish her for that tho? Her punishment-death would actually make a bunch of people happy. It would also work to further the  whole 'the palace/immortal elves are wrong'-thing.

Do *most* fans want to punish her? I know there's a contingent of FBers who made the usual "OMG that bitch!" noises, but I counted that as strictly "trolls be trollin'"

All snark aside, if there is a mass of the fandom that wants a female character to *die* for daring to display some autonomy in this day and age... damn, there goes some more faith in the human race.

kathleen3.0 wrote:

Honestly, I don't CARE anymore who lives or dies.

Won't say I'd NEVER care again ... but I'm most curious HOW WP will make me care about any death after all this "oh, his/her spirit lives on in the Palace Hoorray!"
Make someone care - make some elv(es) REALLY care about a death/a loss ... make me see it through their eyes ... and I will care.

(Hasn't worked in the Pike/Krim case, tho ... all I want is to slap Expiry-date-NOW-Krim. Still.)
Anyone can give me a tip how to slap a spirit?

kathleen3.0 wrote:

Honestly, I don't CARE anymore who lives or dies. And what old friend of Venka's? Does she even have friends, because the Pinis honestly avoided having to explore anymore of her personal history and relationships than they had to, so as far as we know she has no old friends.

Tyleet. They grew up together.


Here's a thought:

The Djunsmen are coming to attack the Wolfriders of Goodtree's rest. However, as far as I know that's quite some distance from the Vastdeep Water, meaning that the Djunsmen will have to march overland to get there. Now, we've already seen that these guys don't care one bit if a few innocent humans get killed as well, especially if they show any signs of honouring the elves, which is exactly what several of the tribes on Iceholt might be doing.

wingthing wrote:

Do *most* fans want to punish her? I know there's a contingent of FBers who made the usual "OMG that bitch!" noises, but I counted that as strictly "trolls be trollin'"

All snark aside, if there is a mass of the fandom that wants a female character to *die* for daring to display some autonomy in this day and age... damn, there goes some more faith in the human race.

Ah yes, the FBers.
But I honestly wouldn't be surprised there are some who are still stuck in that mindset.

Quote :

Venka, daughter of Rayek forced to confront an old friend

Could also be, what's his name, Zhantee?
I don't see why tho?

Two Edge has got to be the old friend

Okay... not Tyleet then...

Maybe it's Someone who haven't actually been introduced yet. Or one of the Go-Backs...

Lunakat wrote:

Two Edge has got to be the old friend

Oh boy, I can't help but think he's going to end up losing his mind completely over something she says.
Or maybe Venka actually loses her temper and snaps at him.

I'd be dissapointed if the one who "returns to the green" would be Treestump or Pike. I think if they want to kill off someone well loved, they should thake Leetah, Nightfall or Skywise. (He had enough time to impregnate Timmain, right?)
It strikes me as a bit lame to kill off Moonshade now, but I agree with Outlier: if it happens, it should be in the palace.
And Venka... I would like it if she would get more attention. Her relationship with Two-Edge is interesting and I like the idea of them together. Or having a fight.

Who says anyone is gonna die?
Maybe someone is just gonna take up golf...

Maybe that's how Cutter gets his peace of mind back! He finds out playing golf really relaxes him and returns to the tribe to teach everyone golf! And then they change their name into the Golfriders!

There's a river the Djun's Men could ship upstream and land close to Blue Mountain. Then they could attack the palace elves and kill Moonshade.

---I don't think Treestup qualifies for a much loved character.---

Hope the golf version turns out to be true

Is the palace at the holy or at blue Mountain at this point?

How would the Djun know to go there? I know he has that kid ember took in to tell him about things-- but wouldn't he only know where Ember's tribe is hiding and/or have some vague notion of where the original holy might be located? He wouldn't know how to get to Bkue Mountain

Lunakat wrote:

How would the Djun know to go there?

Honestly, I imagine they just go around to human villages, raid, torture, kill everybody and then find forests and burn them down while doing their best impression of the Shaman from OQ. At some point they're going to find elves they can kill.

My money's on Two-Edge as the old friend Venka confronts (although Tyleet is a cool idea too...) She's just been shot, and Two-Edge gave that technology to the humans. I'd say she has a lot to take him to task about! And I think he'll be horrified that his handiwork was used to harm his "maiden." Perhaps he'll feel guilty enough that he'll promise to help Treestump et al. make even more powerful weapons to go up against the humans.

I think Treestump's story will play out soon. Something has to come of his exploration of metallurgy. In Dreamtime, his tools turned against him and he was powerless to stop the destruction of his loved ones. I think we'll see that dynamic play out in some form or another...but not quite yet. He and Clearbrook and Ahdri have been in a holding-pattern storywise.

Out of curiosity, I went back to Dreamtime to see if I could find a hint as to who "returns to the green." I didn't reach any conclusions, but some of the language in Redlance's dream is interesting in light of the plant elves. I wonder if his dream of being the spirit of the father tree reflects their experience: "I am connected to many others such as I. In the forest, what one feels, all feel. The knowing is deep and unquestioning--like a lock-send that never ends.There is no loneliness, no such thing as separation."

Redlance's dream seems to have played out--the wolfriders returned to the original holt and a restored father tree. It might be interesting if his treeshaping abilities are regarded as a threat or perversion by the plant-elves. Like, what if they're shapeshifters who identify so closely with the tree-like forms they've adopted that the very idea of plantshaping is horrifying to them.

I don't think we'll see more than a glimpse of the tree elves in issue #14 though. Remember when Timmini was on the cover of one issue but we didn't actually see her until the last page? I suspect this is a similar situation.

Like everyone else, I reeeeally hope nothing happens to Moonshade. That would feel like punishment, a negation of her character arc. I'd be fine if something happened to her later, so long as the story calls for it, but I think we need to see her living as an immortal and being at peace with her choice.

So who's not on the chopping block: Treestump, Clearbrook, Ahdri, Strongbow, Moonshade, Skywise Cutter, and Leetah (we're right in the middle of all of their stories); Venka (she just experienced trauma); all of Ember's tribe (out of sight, out of mind), Rayek/Winnowill (for obvious reasons), and Newstar (not important, sorry Newstar!)

So these characters are potentially in the line of fire (IMO): Ember, Nightfall, Redlance, Pike, and Aroree, Windkin, and Ekuar.

I think Ember's going to stick around for whenever the humans arrive at the original holt. That will probably be the climactic story arc, still half-a-dozen issues away, and if she's safe then the 3 Wolfriders with her are probably safe too. If the danger is from the forest or the plant elves, my bet's on Nightfall or especially Redlance. If the danger is from the humans, my money's on Aroree. Once the humans sail up the coast from the Wavedancers' location, they'll have to move east to the Wolfrider holt...right past the spot FKA Blue Mountain. I bet Aroree and Venka headed back to the palace and the Go-Backs, and I wouldn't be surprised if they're around when the humans arrive.

Lunakat wrote:

How would the Djun know to go there?

Why do the humans do anything in this story? Homo abodensis travels quickly, behaves illogically, and loves to bring the drama!

Funny, I was just about write that Venka's friend would be Two Edge, and their convo would most likely be about how she was injured by the same weapons he helped the humans make.... Wisp beat me to it. I would be surprised if that conversation *didn't* happen.

Interesting stuff, about the plant elves maybe viewing Redlance's abilities as some kind of perversion.
On the other hand...there's also a possibility that they might see him as a potential cosmetic surgeon for them LOL.
No, I'm sure they won't, that would be daft. But I can totally see them viewing him as a threat.
Nightfall or Redlance on the chopping block would be interesting.
I can't see Windkin or Aroree on the chopping block (I forgot about those 2)... I don't know why, I'm just not feeling it. They feel very unimportant story wise for the time being. Killing them off doesn't seem like it would do much except just kill them off for the sake of it. But then maybe Wendy sees them as characters no longer needed and who might just be ok to get rid of, I don't know. But their floating abilities are needed probably to get elves out of harm's way, and maybe Wendy figures if at least one floater is around, she can kill off the other one. It sort of sounds bad to say, but I wouldn't be very affected by either of those two dying. Yes it's sad but it's not heart wrenchingly sad.

Ekuar would make sense, but if Rogue's Curse is canon, which supposedly it is, then that's not a possibility.
I can see Ember dying later in FQ... but not right away, you're right, Wisp, that it would be a longer story arc.

I feel for a death to be truly 'sad' (and apparently it's being shopped around that this one is), it would need to be an OQ character.
They've killed off so many other elves and didn't really make a big deal out of it in reviews, did they? I think Wendy wrote at one point that she was crying as she was writing it, and I think she was referring to the upcoming issue.

Could it be Cutter?

Wisp wrote:

Why do the humans do anything in this story?  Homo abodensis travels quickly, behaves illogically, and loves to bring the drama!  

I'm just enjoying imagining the look on the Djun's face at being called "homo." I don't think he's the kind to take it with any sort of grace.

Considering how he handled losing his dick, it wouldn't be surprising he's lose his shit over a word.

manga wrote:

I'm just enjoying imagining the look on the Djun's face at being called "homo." I don't think he's the kind to take it with any sort of grace.

<snort> Too true!

zadzi wrote:

Funny, I was just about write that Venka's friend would be Two Edge, and their convo would most likely be about how she was injured by the same weapons he helped the humans make.... Wisp beat me to it.

Great minds, Zadzi!

No doubt, the saddest loss would have to be Nightfall or Redlance, right? If Nightfall does die, that would make her farewell to Strongbow all the more poignant. Poor Strongbow, everyone's leaving him!

The only reason I feel like it could be Aroree is because she goes all the way back to the OQ and she's presumably around if the humans arrive at "Blue Mountain" and get up to their usual ultraviolence. And like you said, she's redundant at this point (I don't think Wendy would kill Windkin because he's her spirit animal.)

I just can't believe it will be Cutter because that would cut off his hero's journey midstream. He's descended into the cave, reached the spiritual nadir. He'll come face to face with death (maybe that's even the moment with the wolves,) but then he has to come out again. I think Wendy and Richard understand the mythic structure well enough that they won't mess with that. At this point, my question is whether he will eventually merge with Timmain or if Timmain will merge with him.

I just was guessing that the plant elves were probably all plant shapers and self shapers. They seem to have shaped themselves and plants into themselves. In nightfall's dream, she was defending everyone against a looming, hungry shadow. The shadow was winning, until she realized that fighting wasn't the answer. But she got interrupted just as she realized what try solution was.

Maybe she is the one to die? Redlance, it seems, would be best able to communicate with our fungal friends. I sort of like the idea of either he or Nightfall recognizing one of them.

Or... Maybe Redlance sacrifices himself to communicate with them by literally returning to the green and merging somehow with the forest.

What about Dr. Dre? Dre has to do something or why is he there?

Lunakat wrote:

What about Dr. Dre? Dre has to do something or why is he there?

It's the pony. The pony dies and it's supposed to be sad and we're supposed to be sad for him.