Final Quest #12

Yeah, but this isn't actually Teir, it's Wendy's oc with his name.

Wow, the examples of the recycled art and the one with an old drawing next to it are depressing, indeed. Even the proportions are off.

Ill play a little Devils Advocate for you, if I may (from my own perspective/wandering thoughts, though several things you pointed out I actually agree with. Just exploring alternate possibilities)?

I dont have much to comment on about the literalness of Tam=Sliver of Timmain. Ill circle back if I come up with something though.

Leetah's involvement: I got the impression Timmain was pointing out Leetah DID NOT know any more about Cutter than what she could see of "his" spirit: Tam. She knew he was mortal, that we knew, and we know she recognized "Tam", but we havent seen her "Go Out" or do anything of the spirit, indeed she was unable to work with One-Eye's spirit (or was unwilling to explore any possible ability), so while she may have healed his body, she didnt try to or wasnt able to keep the "ghost in the shell" as it were. Her abilities seem limited to physical healing: she couldnt heal Winnie any of the times she had option to, and even Two Edge's healing was limited (presumably the mental/spiritual part was beyond her ability, IMO). I didnt count it against her.

What I will point out here is a potential interpretation of Timmain's actions: one could consider Timmain to be as treacherous as Winnie, perhaps even more so. Let me explain: Tam, as Cutter, Recognized both Leetah and Skywise. Leetah wouldnt reasonably know any difference, as a male/female Recognition resulting in birth was no big deal (beyond him being a savage that abducted her, that is). Cutter/Skywise were kids and didnt have a clue what to think, but didnt have any reason to think this far outside the box. However, when Timmain reveals herself to him, by all rights he should have felt some familiarity between consumating Recognition with Timmain and the unfulfilled Recog with Cutter, and put the two together a lot easier than Cutter or Leetah would. He appears clueless, though, even more so than Leetah. There seems only two or three explainations for the to me. (One being that Leetah knows and isnt saying anything, but that doesnt change the other two): either Skywise is hiding his knowledge of what happened (which he has no reason to), or Timmain is actually able to "hide" her two self's from those that recognize those selves! So, while most Elves are completely helpless with Recognition revealing all parts of their inner self to another, Timmain has the option of hiding a not-to-subtle truth about her spirit from one supposedly recognized to... well... both? halves of her spirit? He recognized her Tam half but consumated with her other half, but she still was able to keep all this from him? Something's fishy, and Im not talking about the barnicles growing on the Djun's ships under-armor)

Reef: a large part of me (like 88.763% give or take) was like "Shazaam! Game On!" When Reef make his change. I drank in the scene with much anticipation of the next frame... and actually went looking for a missing page. I felt left in the lurch wondering what happens next.

Anyway, my interpretation of a possible view on the "completion": I hadnt realize until reading the comments here that he had been a healer (Ill get to the second view in a moment), but I looked at the scene as he made his own interpretation of what Winnie tried to do to him, and actually self generated the image based on his own thoughts and views, not her's. Now knowing that he was a healer himself, obviously it was essentially a "wizards' duel" where he was outclassed in a similar discipline, and must have had his mind altered in the process (else he would have healed himself), his recollection of that time would logically be skewed by damage and time. I figure he might have cycled through his self image for all that time, and perhaps generated his own conclusion of what his form should be as the healer in him tried to figure out what form he was supposed to be (elf or something else). Rage fueled percieved necessity, and he changed himself into some conclusion he had formed before.

Personally, the "healed Reef" didnt work for me, kind of a ultimate stereotype of Wavedancers in a passive, not quite mermaid (yes, that was intentional) creature that doesnt have much of any place in anything. This new form has purpose, direction, ...teeth! I like it, and while its form may have had some sort of roots in Winnie's twisting, I feel its a positive step (well, at least until I see if anything comes of it, that is).

Winnie/Rayak: not that much to say, other than Winnie is the master of manipulation. Can we be sure that her statement of Rayak's rage being a cause of her awakening? It seems to me more likely that she's always "alert" to a moment of weakness or opportunity for exploitation. Winnie has always wanted Rayak's strength and powers, and it would seem likely that she saw an opportunity here to tease Rayak with his own memories of the Go-Backs long ago and his actions then, say what she could to press his buttons, and manipulate him into any kind of mindset or action that allowed her any sort of control. Winnie has been in his head since her death (perhaps a little before to a degree) with nothing to do but explore his limits, memories, actions, and everything else. Rayak has had to live, survive, keep her restrained, and deal with his own problems during the same time. She should have the upper hand at this point.

The singer: i dont get mystery from him, I dont even get shallow, paper thin character from the character. I get nothing. The father tree has more character development, purpose, depth, and influence in the story, and it didnt do anything but get pushed around by tree-shapers and burn!


To a degree I have been trying to figure out the chopiness to the story, why it feels like there are gaps. I have another new theory: Wendy might have had notes, preliminary art, storyboards, and other work for years, possibly since the beginning. I have similar notes and writing scattered all over spanning three decades of thoughts, ideas, and whatnot, scattered between three houses, ten or more storage locations, mixed with three decades of junk. Occasionally I come across a note and wonder what the heck I was thinking, or marvel at some small insight I made in the past. I habe a whole cartoon strip somewhere Id like to revamp and fill out, stories Id like to add, new ideas, and a whole new mindset seasoned with 20 years of maturity.

What Im wondering is if some of the abruptness is in unfinished ghosts of the past. I got the impression that the intent in the 90s was for decades' more storylines, where the singer (cant recall name and phone is dieing fast) had his own series, Cutter's revelation by Timmain was its own quest, the battle with the navy was another seperate quest, and so on. The market had an upset, and now all that has to be rolled into one push, put into.a blender, handed off to someone else to color, and yet another company to publish... does that make any sense?

Anyway, sorry for rambling, havent done much of late and my fingers were itchy.

Miss Gillespie wrote:

How about Dart who actually used to lead a tribe?

Well... Dart and Freetouch are staying in Goodtree's Rest.

The way I figured it Scouter and Teir are leading them together, but it's such a small tribe - just 12 members, including the humans - they'll probably all be pretty equal.
What I'm really surprised about is the fact that Teir is willing to be separated from Ember for an unknown period of time. Maybe he knows that he needs to learn not to be so dependant on her.

Quote :

If I were Ember, I'd leave Tyleet in charge!

I'd like to see that  

Miss Gillespie wrote:

How about Dart who actually used to lead a tribe? Teir lived alone for ages and I think he already said once, that he only cared for Ember, no one else

Teir said somewhere in the wild hunt story that he cares much for all his tribemates. So I don't think it's the matter. But I agree he does not seem the best for it from what we've seen of him. We'll see.

Redhead Ember wrote:

Well... Dart and Freetouch are staying in Goodtree's Rest.

No, they're actually going to... Whatever Holt. I had to re-read the page to work it out  Strongbow tell Mender and Dart to stay together, and then it's said that "Teir and is 3 tribemates" go back. That means everyone but Ember.

TrollHammer wrote:

To a degree I have been trying to figure out the chopiness to the story, why it feels like there are gaps. I have another new theory: Wendy might have had notes, preliminary art, storyboards, and other work for years, possibly since the beginning. I have similar notes and writing scattered all over spanning three decades of thoughts, ideas, and whatnot, scattered between three houses, ten or more storage locations, mixed with three decades of junk. Occasionally I come across a note and wonder what the heck I was thinking, or marvel at some small insight I made in the past. I habe a whole cartoon strip somewhere Id like to revamp and fill out, stories Id like to add, new ideas, and a whole new mindset seasoned with 20 years of maturity.

What Im wondering is if some of the abruptness is in unfinished ghosts of the past.

Aaah yes. Could be. Thanks for the rambling I try to picture myself working on the same story for that long... After one year on the same stuff, it starts getting heavy for me. Like a dead something I must keep alive. I know I can't work on something that's not alive in me in the now. So I tell myself: she's doing her best. In a very short time. I wish she could give herself more time. And the will to do that story must be strong, for them not to give it up!

I thought Strongbow was simply telling Dart and Mender to "Stick together for as long as they could."
Mender is needed in High Winds Holt, because they need a healer, and I guess you could argue that Dart and Freetouch need to be with Strongbow and Moonshade, or just Strongbow if Moonshade has already returned with the Palace.
But maybe Dart doesn't want to lead.

Dart and Freetouch are going with Mender. It says "Sunstream takes Teir and his three tribemates to High Winds Holt."
Dart was already pretty reluctant to lead in the Forevergreen story. I don't think he wants the job. I don't see how either Teir or Scouter is qualified, but Ember probably knows what she's doing...

Maybe neither of them are 100% qualified, but they're the only ones who're at least somewhat qualified - if only about 80%.

So who went where? Right now I'm only sure that Cutter ran away..

^^ Only sure thing.

I needed 2 reading to work it out: see elves are back under the sea, except Sunstream who seems to be at Father Tree holt, Ember elves are all back home except Ember, the palace is back at Blue mountain, Rayek and his little group are near the sea. The group we see on last page are going to look for Cutter, not sure whether Ember and the rest are going too.

As I understood it Ember will stay at the Cutterelfsholt to lead them until her father gets back. And Leetah, Nightfall, Redlance, Skywise and Dre-Ahn are going to look for Cutter.

I've had the same thing happen with writing, where I save notes everywhere for years and then go back and do a project. Hell, some projects just do not let you go, after years of endless work and playing around with them. And it is like trying to resurrect the dead at times... but in some ways it's also like letting something die and using what's left of it to start anew. Some stories just have to be told and won't release you until you tell the story from beginning to end, it's like some kind of pact you've made and you have to make good on your promise by actually completing the story.
Sometimes though, no matter how many notes and concepts you have, you find in the execution that the result really doesn't work the way you imagine or wanted. Sometimes it's a nice surprise, other times it's like ugh wtf is this. Time to go back to the drawing board (literally and figuratively)! I think it's probably very hard to be doing a series of issues with a strict timeline if your story isn't completely flushed through...hell, it's hard even if it is flushed through AND you have to worry about artwork also. I was sort of shocked at how close to the wire they are when they're releasing the new issues, and i sometimes wonder if Wendy sort of just rolling with it as much as she can. I wonder often if she is truly pleased with the result or looking at it in a somber way as something that just needs to be done once and for all. I get the feeling she really did make a pact with herself about EQ and the story wrapping up is part of a need to fulfill some unspoken promise.

That's a good way to put it, Zadzi-- some projects don't let you go.

I agree with everything Trollhammer said, except.. I can totally see how recognizing Timmain might be different from recognizing Cutter. Because she's more. Cutter is just a part of her (yes, I'm rolling with this plot twist-- just accepting and going with it). He would also, having developed separately from her, be himself. Skywise did say to Leetah that being with Timmain felt like being with her and Cutter. So he touched on that. But it would have be more than that, as well-- because she has centuries of life experience and space travel behind her, and all the accumulated wisdom to go along with it would be part of her being. It's not part of Cutter's.

I think Wendy has dementia.

Okay, haven't read the last few pages of this topic, so sorry if I'm repeating things. This issue was not as bad as I expected- at least it looks like Cutter is putting up a fight against having his identity usurped. Art still very hit and miss, some very good frames- I liked the whole Rayek/Venka/Windkin/Ekuar interaction. But then again, who put that poor pony on steroids? And the very obvious copying and pasting is just....So obvious.
Also,
-the Creature from the Black Lagoon on the world of Two Moons! How exiting! So Reef was a shape shifter all along and Winnowill just triggered his power.
-It's nice to see Ahnshen get a mention.
-who is the Sunvillage elf appearing in the pony scene?
-Windkin is delightfully morally questionable, and his wings are silly. And Rayek seems to keep up with him without wings?
-I get the feeling that Rayek kind of likes humans; the peaceful ones anyway. He has behaved protective towards mostly females in most of the Rogue's Curse books, and the killing of the old man really got his goat. Enough for a Winek takeover...Of course his best intentions always end in tears.
-Venka does not look fatally injured, but she will need a healer. Now, they happen to have a perfectly good healer around. Except that she's crazy. And dead! It will be interesting to see how this will play out.


The Djunslanders are in lots of trouble.

If Cutter separates Tam from Timmain, will Timmain lose all interest in Skywise?

Why does Venka suddenly need to make eye contact to subdue Winnowill? She shut her down across an entire ocean before. I know the answer is just so Venka can be shot, but it still bugs. It would be cool to see Winnowill heal her through Rayek. If he can tap into her destructive powers, why not the good stuff too?

...or that.

Maybe it's different now that Winnowill is inside Rayek.

It would make for an interesting standoff. Of course she hates Venka for always blocking her- and now that Venka is injured she is in a very powerful position. Venka dies, good for Winnowill. If Venka is going to live, there had better be a good reward in it. Interesting shift in power balance.

Elwing wrote:

But then again, who put that poor pony on steroids?

Sunstream. By flying with it in a Palace Pod.

Elwing wrote:

-It's nice to see Ahnshen get a mention.

Yeah! I especially love the fact that he was specifically mentioned as being the one making Rayek's new clothes.

Elwing wrote:

-who is the Sunvillage elf appearing in the pony scene?

Ohler. Lutei's Brother and Newstars new lovemate. And by "new" I mean they got together way back in the Special, before Ruffel died.

Now that's HARD.
Non of us is a doctor and non of us has proved to be able to read the truth from a crystal sphere.

We can tell our opinion about the art About the story. We know what we like and what we hoped for. We can easily compare old and new art and discuss the differencies and weaknesses. We have fan artists and writers and professional artists and passionate readers - people who know enough about storytelling, drawing and coloring to point out failures.

But such a remote diagnosis on health is damn too personal and ungrounded in my opinion! Hurtful ... for Wendy and Richard Pini. And for everyone who actually suffers from dementia because it was used comes across as an insult.

Tymber wrote:

I liked seeing Rayek back in "Sun Village" clothing; and more in touch with the colors I recognize him in. However, I wonder why Ahnshen didn't make Ekaur some clothing too? The poor guy is literally in rags, and perhaps the one - of all the elves - in need of some new clothing!

Actually, I'm not so sure he didn't. The clothes Ekuar is wearing in this issue is decidedly different from those he wore in issue 10 - less raggey for starters.

Ah, thanks! I was wondering if it was Ingen...

Outlier wrote:

Why does Venka suddenly need to make eye contact to subdue Winnowill? She shut her down across an entire ocean before.

Because who needs consistency!